Hallo! Neu in diesem Forum-Frage zur Herkunft des indirekten Grillens

[grob1234]

Thanks so much. I would love to see a preparation for grilled beef cheeks that you mentioned above.

those are in the thread
Cheeks of ox or beef
Saltzburg cookbook, Conrad Hagger, 1719

Chop them into pieces and brown them on the griddle in juice with fats / place in dish with vinegar / onion / garlic / rosemary / lemon zest and seasoning ; or with browned turnips / without vinegar / or different cabbage and cabbage with bacon ; as a podwatschga with tasty herbs; when it is well watered / it can be boiled softly / and removed from the bones / and after it is salted / peppered with garlic / sage and bacon / with spices / bacon slices / stirred in / bequeathed with sufficient pork loin (green bacon) provided / steamed in the oven with bay leaves and lemon zest / or roasted on a spit ; you can also roast it on the grid with dressed bread (crumbled) / like Presolen

 

[Paul_BBQ]

those are in the thread
Cheeks of ox or beef
Saltzburg cookbook, Conrad Hagger, 1719

Chop them into pieces and brown them on the griddle in juice with fats / place in dish with vinegar / onion / garlic / rosemary / lemon zest and seasoning ; or with browned turnips / without vinegar / or different cabbage and cabbage with bacon ; as a podwatschga with tasty herbs; when it is well watered / it can be boiled softly / and removed from the bones / and after it is salted / peppered with garlic / sage and bacon / with spices / bacon slices / stirred in / bequeathed with sufficient pork loin (green bacon) provided / steamed in the oven with bay leaves and lemon zest / or roasted on a spit ; you can also roast it on the grid with dressed bread (crumbled) / like Presolen

Its so intresting that there were recipes for smoked brisket, beef cheeks, ribs everything that we think of as American BBQ.

 

[Paul_BBQ]

those are in the thread
Cheeks of ox or beef
Saltzburg cookbook, Conrad Hagger, 1719

Chop them into pieces and brown them on the griddle in juice with fats / place in dish with vinegar / onion / garlic / rosemary / lemon zest and seasoning ; or with browned turnips / without vinegar / or different cabbage and cabbage with bacon ; as a podwatschga with tasty herbs; when it is well watered / it can be boiled softly / and removed from the bones / and after it is salted / peppered with garlic / sage and bacon / with spices / bacon slices / stirred in / bequeathed with sufficient pork loin (green bacon) provided / steamed in the oven with bay leaves and lemon zest / or roasted on a spit ; you can also roast it on the grid with dressed bread (crumbled) / like Presolen

Also with regards to backhendl does it taste like American fried chicken?

I think potato salad in America likely has German roots too.

 

[pellinger]

Also with regards to backhendl does it taste like American fried chicken?

I think potato salad in America likely has German roots too.

Sorry for the late reply, but unfortunately I did`t seen your thread up to now. If you are still interested in the topic around German sausages, I have very old family recipes that come from my mother's grandmother (1872-1921). My family is originally from the Kingdom of Hannover and the Kingdom of Preussen (see map below, copied from my mother's grandmother's textbook, red cross). Just write me, then I would publish the old recipes here. translated, of course. Since I'm writing a cookbook, I discovered this old recipe book.

 

[Broilermanny]

An interesting site for you?

https://amazingribs.com/barbecue-history-and-culture/barbecue-history/

 

[Paul_BBQ]

If you look at old cookbooks, smoked beef brisket is definetely a thing in german speaking countries back in the 1800s. But they salted/cured it. My theory is, that the texan germans didn't smoke it for preservation, but for consumption. So, not curing but hot-smoking makes totally sense.

Just 2 examples:
"Großes Wiener Kochbuch" from 1827 (Viennese/Austrian Cookbook). The only recipe for smoked beef requires brisket.
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"Neues auf Erfahrung gegründetes leichtfaßliches Kochbuch für jede Haushaltung" from 1835 (German Cookbook)
There is one recipe for smoking pork and beef in general and only one specific - "Geräucherte Rinderbrust". It also requires brisket.
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What do you think are the odds that migrant Germans in Texas would have been familiar with these recipes? Some say smoked brisket is a new thing. Others trace it to a jewish deli in Texas. Not sure what to believe,

 

[Paul_BBQ]

Sorry for the late reply, but unfortunately I did`t seen your thread up to now. If you are still interested in the topic around German sausages, I have very old family recipes that come from my mother's grandmother (1872-1921). My family is originally from the Kingdom of Hannover and the Kingdom of Preussen (see map below, copied from my mother's grandmother's textbook, red cross). Just write me, then I would publish the old recipes here. translated, of course. Since I'm writing a cookbook, I discovered this old recipe book.

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This is great. Would love to see those recipes and anything meat/BBQ related.

 

[grob1234]

What do you think are the odds that migrant Germans in Texas would have been familiar with these recipes? Some say smoked brisket is a new thing. Others trace it to a jewish deli in Texas.

Keep in mind that most Jews from Europe lived in Central and Eastern Europe. So they brought these cuisines but added the kosher part. It's not so much an either/or question.

 

[Paul_BBQ]

Keep in mind that most Jews from Europe lived in Central and Eastern Europe. So they brought these cuisines but added the kosher part. It's not so much an either/or question.

I see. Others say in the early days the whole beef forequarter was cooked.

 

[grob1234]

Found this, from 1835, published in Boston. Smoked hams from Westphalia and smoked beef from Hamburg seem to have been popular and also praised in the best tones.

 

[Paul_BBQ]

Found this, from 1835, published in Boston. Smoked hams from Westphalia and smoked beef from Hamburg seem to have been popular and also praised in the best tones.
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The smoked beef would be something like bresoala or corned beef?

 

[grob1234]

 

[Luse]

Hi Paul
I don't think it's necessary to travel to Europe to find the beginnings of Texas BBQ.

Do you know this book:

There are e.g. the following pictures in it

Ok, those aren't pigs and cattle on the pit, but I think the settlers adopted the method of preparation and just changed the animals to more familiar species.
Native Americans also dried meat and certainly also smoked it, the smoke in the pictures is clearly shown.

 

[Paul_BBQ]

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Thanks. That's interesting. Still having trouble imaginig what this would look like though. Similar to smoked brisket or more like a cold cut or pastrami or jerky?
Or something like this
https://thehappyfoodie.co.uk/recipes/salting-brisket/

 

[Paul_BBQ]

Actually I guess this would be the closest thing to salted and smoked brisket

https://meateatingmilitaryman.com/smoked-corned-beef/

 

[grob1234]

Still having trouble imaginig what this would look like though.

Example 1, example 2.

 

[Paul_BBQ]

Example 1, example 2.

Thanks. So similar to a cold cut